The Andre Drummond of Authors, without the Multi-Million Dollar Contract: An Interviewwith Kevin Sampsell
Leigh Chadwick: Hey, Kevin. First of all, I just want to say congratulations on being chosen to be part of my “Mediocre Conversations” interview series here at Olney Magazine.
Kevin Sampsell: Thanks for having me. I’m sure this will be at least above average.
LC: We’ll see. I do appreciate your optimism, though.
So, let’s get started. Looking over your body of work, it appears you’ve done a little bit of everything?
KEVIN SAMPSELL IS A WRITER, PUBLISHER, COLLAGE ARTIST, AND BOOKSELLER IN PORTLAND, OREGON. HE RUNS THE SMALL PRESS, FUTURE TENSE BOOKS, AND IS ALSO THE CO-CURATOR OF THE INTERNATIONAL COLLAGE WEBSITE, SHARP HANDS GALLERY. HIS PREVIOUS BOOKS INCLUDE THE NOVEL, THIS IS BETWEEN US, AND THE MEMOIR, A COMMON PORNOGRAPHY.
KS: And yet I have no championship rings to show for it. Unless you count the 1983 NBA title that Moses Malone delivered to me and Julius Erving. I remember that night so clearly. I think I just got my driver’s license and drove to Burger King to feel the glory. My celebratory plain cheeseburger was delicious.
LC: And yet, I do not count that. So it’s safe to say that the closest you have felt to success was eight years before I was born?
KS: Success is relative. For example, the year you were born, the Philadelphia 76ers had Charles Barkley and Manut Bol on the same team. Imagine that. Two Hall of Famers.
LC: Manut Bol is a name I haven’t heard in a minute. Fun fact: After the 76ers released Bol in 1993, he was acquired by the Miami Heat, where he played a total of eight games and scored two points. He tallied a total of sixty-one minutes in a Heat uniform. Also, to fall further down this rabbit hole: In the Warriors trade that sent Manut Bol to the 76ers, Philly gave up a 1991 first round draft pick, which led to the Warriors drafting Chris Gatling, who also ended up eventually playing for the Heat. (He was part of the trade package that brought Timmy Hardaway to South Beach.)
This is where I should probably mention that you are a die-hard Philadelphia 76ers fan, and that I am a die-hard fan of the more relevant (see, actual championships and finals appearances in the 21st century) Miami Heat.
I will come back to basketball, because obviously, but I figure we should mention this writing/artist thing you are doing. Tell us a bit about it.
KS: My new book, I Made an Accident, combines two naive art forms that I’ve cultivated over the years: poetry and collage. Without academic resources, I developed a sort of DIY passion for both. I started writing poetry as a kid and more seriously in my 20s, sharpening whatever style or voice I have now. With collage, my deeper discovery of it is much newer–just in the last eight or so years–but the process of learning about it and making it has been to the point of obsession. Though one is written and the other is a visual exercise, I think they share many of the same underlying qualities, such as fragmentation, mystery, and an ability to haunt. And though I’ve been writing poetry for decades, I still feel like I’m not sure what it is. I think combining collage and poetry side by side gives each form slightly more cohesion. I mean, I think you can “read” I Made an Accident and maybe still feel like you’re inside a story, or perhaps on a strange life journey.
LC: I Made an Accident is a big shift from your previous work, which includes a novel, This Is Between Us (a book that felt fragmented, which feels like a stylistic choice you have embraced throughout your “career”), as well as a memoir about porn, I believe? (I didn’t do a whole lot of research for this interview…I started to and then, well, I found a beige wall to stare at for a while, which was much more enjoyable.)
Collaging (and writing poetry, for that matter) is quite the career shift. Did you choose switching from prose to collaging because you realized you would never be a famous novelist?
KS: My “career” is not really writing or collaging. At least I don’t want to think of them in that way. The word career feels heavy and takes the fun out of it. I’d rather have a “life” in collaging and writing–as well as in bookselling and publishing. That sounds more worthwhile.
But as far as the switch goes, I was just ready to do something different. I always say writing is about thinking and collaging is about seeing. I wanted to think less and enjoy a creative outlet that was more visual. Some may see it as a shift, but it also feels totally natural to me.
LC: You’ve been a bookseller at Powell’s for some time now. How has being a bookseller shaped the way you’ve approached writing and publishing, let alone running your own small press?
(And for those unaware, Powell’s is a quaint, little, slightly obscure bookstore—think the bookstore Meg Ryan owns in You’ve Got Mail—that’s located in Portland, the Portland in Oregon, not the one in Maine. An easy confusion, I know.)
KS: When I bought the Powell’s company from Jeff Bezos on Thanksgiving Day, 1997, I knew I’d always have books in my life. My goal was to eventually turn it into a Wal-Mart but something changed inside my heart and I decided I want to serve the people instead. Not just any people, but the weird people who read and write books. Now, nearly 25 years later, I have no regrets, and very few regrets.
Being a bookseller is interesting though. It helps you understand so many facets of the literary world, from writing and publishing to distribution and promotion. I really do get to see it all and learn from it. I’m lucky to be doing what I do, and to love doing it.
LC: Kevin Sampsell, single handedly making Jeff Bezos a billionaire.
Because I’m Leigh Chadwick and I can do whatever the hell I want, I decided to put two questions in this question.
First: Working in publishing from all sides and throughout a book’s full lifecycle, what would you say is needed to make a successful marketing campaign, especially for those publishing with small, independent presses?
And two: As a bookseller at Powell’s, are you also responsible for, or do you participate in, booking authors for readings/events?
KS: Contrary to what agents say, I think the less social media followers you have, the better. It adds an air of mystery that you just can’t teach. If I ever find someone with zero followers, I am super intrigued, but usually they turn out to be bots. Other things authors need: patience, one of those Square devices to plug into their phone, and a nice outfit.
My official title at Powell’s (besides Secret Owner) is Events Coordinator. I have less to do with scheduling and booking and more to do with actually running the events–folding chairs, plugging in the microphone, ordering the preferred sushi, turning on the fog machine, DJing the after-party. Would you like to know how Matt Bell likes his sushi?
LC: After this interview is published, you are going to see so many writers deleting all their social media (this might not be a bad thing) and querying Future Tense Books.
If you’re DJing the after-party, who’s DJing the after-after-party?
Kevin, the entire reason for starting this interview series has always been to find out how Matt Bell likes his sushi…
KS: He likes it plain (no fish) on tiny pieces of fry bread. I guess that’s called Arizona Style. It sounds unorthodox for sure, but who are we to doubt Matt Bell.
LC: That sounds very Matt Bell. I am imagining him keeping a roll of his Arizona Style sushi in a knapsack that he takes with him on his daily runs through the desert, eating them during a break from his run while sitting under a cactus.
Now I have no idea what we were talking about…
I did want to ask about your relationship with your new publisher. I Made an Accident was published by CLASH Books. This is your first book with them. I am always interested in how a book lands with a specific publisher. How did I Made an Accident and CLASH Books find each other?
More importantly, how are you getting along with a press that is very pro Miami Heat?
KS: Look, Leigh, I like Duncan Robinson as much as the next guy, but I don’t know if I could name another player on the Heat right now. Didn’t they trade everyone for Kevin Durant? As far as CLASH goes, it’s been great. I pitched the book idea to them after seeing the art book they published by Matthew Revert in 2019. I was impressed by how it looked and how goofballs it was. They were fans of my collage work, so it worked perfectly. And I was lucky to have Mr. Revert design my book as well. He is a book design king.
Leza and Christoph are enthusiastic and risk-taking publishers with amazing bandwidth and multi-tasking skills. I respect them a great deal. I’ve been on so many different presses over the years, I feel like the Andre Drummond of authors, without the multi-million dollar contract.
LC: The Heat have that guy you got rid of to keep the other guy you ended up getting rid of anyway.
Okay, Kevin, are you ready for the speed round portion of this interview?
KS:To quote Betty White: “Bring it on!”
LC: Have you ever met Kelly Link? And if so, do you think Kelly and I would be best friends?
KS: I have met her and she is royalty. No one is good enough to be her friend.
LC: I want to argue that, but I don’t think I can. (Kelly, if you somehow read this, I’m only a message away.)
What is your favorite song to listen to after you’ve listened to your favorite song?
KS: I have many favorite songs, so this question makes total sense. Just a random example. I’d follow this quiet little song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvsiExEe57s
With this wild epic rooftop performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYF4wbyrNyY
I met Ira Kaplan at Powell’s in 2019 and told him I watch this video all the time and he admitted that he watches it sometimes too (trying to figure out how he was making those guitar sounds).
LC: Not gonna lie, I respect the name drop.
Next question: Sporks. Why?
KS: Sporks are versatile and beautiful. Whoever invented them was not fucking around. Also, there is Spork Press, which has put out some of the most beautiful books for the past decade or so. The two books they just published are two of my faves of this year: https://thisissporkpress.com/
LC: How many copies of Your Favorite Poet do you think will sell at Powell’s?
KS: At least five. Maybe five hundred if you put an ad in all the big magazines. People, Entertainment Weekly, Readers’ Digest, Time, Cat Fancy.
LC: What if the book came with a bookmark that had the recipe for Matt Bell’s Arizona Style sushi printed on it?
KS: I think that actually deserves a whole book unto itself. There really is no recipe for success, Leigh. We’re all just bumbling around, making accidents.
LC: Who wins the NBA Championship this upcoming season, and why is it the Miami Heat?
KS: The only way the Heat win is if they play Duncan Herro at least thirty minutes every game. I would say the Sixers are getting it this year, but I have to go with the Portland Trailblazers, because Justise Winslow is a beast.
LC: The Philadelphia 76ers have an impressive history of ruining promising careers (i.e. Markelle Fultz, Ben Simmons, and yes, I am going there–Andrew Bynum). Why do you think that is?
KS: Do not ever speak the name Andrew Bynum to me! He is the curse! The original sin! Markelle’s struggles and Ben’s romantic woes are all because of him. We should have never done business with the Lakers!
LC: Taylor Swift’s folklore or evermore?
KS: I’m still stunned about Taylor becoming the new singer for The National. I’ll say folklore, because first albums are usually the best.
LC: That is incorrect. The correct answer is Red (Taylor’s Version).
Though “the 1” is my favorite Taylor Swift track. How she starts the album with I’m doing good / I’m on some new shit, it’s like, Hell yes you are. You do that new shit. And she does. She does that new shit.
I do think The National bringing Taylor Swift on as their new lead singer was a smart move. folklore is definitely their best album since High Violet.
OK, speed round completed.
I want to circle back to I Made an Accident. I would love to hear a bit of your process in putting a collage together. What is your favorite collage in the book? How did you create it? As someone who has never worked in the medium, I am curious to know, in your opinion, what does a collage say that a piece of text can’t?
KS: There are a couple of collages toward the end that are part of a newer “quilt” style of collage that I really got into making after acquiring a huge Montgomery Ward catalog from 1957. I basically went through it (and I’m still going through it!), cutting out swaths of clothing–fluttery dresses, wrinkled shirts, stuff like that. I combined them with parts of painted illustrations from pulpy short story magazines. Like action shots of guys in suits chasing gangsters or women striking romantic poses. I basically made a big pile of pieces and then glued them onto a big wood panel, sort of willy-nilly. Unlike many of the collages in the book that are just a couple of pieces, these quilt collages have twenty to sixty little pieces. The painting equivalent would maybe be like Jackson Pollock or action painting.
Another favorite would be Lasso, on page 41, with takes three circus performers and weaves them together so that their juggling, unicycling, balancing, and lassoing become trance-like. And on page 101, in the collage Corned Beef Cocktail, you can see another recent-ish style shift, where I cut through words to give off a suggestion of language without being legible. These “shards,” as I call them, also add an energy and movement to the collages I’ve been making more recently.
As far as what a collage says, I find that the images often suggest or imply more than a sentence or paragraph of writing. I’m not very political in my writing, but sometimes I can make collages that give off a very political vibe. Perhaps it’s because visual art can be more open to interpretation than writing.
LC: So what’s next for you?
KS: I’m doing a little tour in the last part of September. It starts in Denver on the 16th and then I’m renting a car and driving to places like Wichita, Lawrence, Kansas, and Nashville.
https://kevinsampsell.com/2022/06/05/a-little-summer-somethings/
When I come back, I’ll have to tackle a bunch of other projects, including the next Future Tense release, Foreign Body by Katie Gene Friedman, and more writing of my own. Collage-wise, I’ll be working on the next virtual show at https://www.sharphandsgallery.com/ (with my co-curator, Cheryl Chudyk) and I’m going to do a thing on my Instagram at some point called #ShardWeek to spread the word about the beauty and glory of shard-heavy collages.
LC: As we begin to wind down with the interview, I want to ask you: What is a question Kevin Sampsell would have asked Kevin Sampsell that Leigh Chadwick should asked Kevin Sampsell?
KS: This question reminds me of those “self-interviews” that The Nervous Breakdown used to do. I think you should have asked me what my favorite article of clothes is. I am very enthusiastic about the socks made by a company called American Trench. They never wear out and they never get stinky. They’re miracles for your feet.
LC: I like to end these interviews with having the interviewee sharing some love. Who is a writer you feel is currently flying under the radar? Someone whose writing you’re wild about that should have a much bigger audience than they currently do?
Also, please feel free to drop a link to something they’ve published.
KS: So many underappreciated writers out there! I love the absolute shit out of Shane Kowalski’s Small Moods. I don’t think there’s anything like it. https://futuretensebooks.com/product/small-moods/
I also love to recommend books by folks like Joanna Ruocco, Susan Steinberg (my cat is named after her), and Portlanders like Kimberly King Parsons, Casey Parks, Chris Stuck, and Jules Ohman.
https://www.powells.com/book/black-light-9780525563501
https://www.powells.com/book/diary-of-a-misfit-9780525658535
https://www.powells.com/book/give-my-love-to-the-savages-9780063029989
https://www.powells.com/book/body-grammar-9780593466698
And shout-out to some of my favorite collage artists too.
John Gall https://nearlywaves.tumblr.com/
Jay Berrones https://doncaminos.com/
Allison Anne https://allisonanne.bigcartel.com/
LC: So this interview wasn’t completely useless. We learned a few things: Matt Bell prefers his sushi Arizona Style, Andrew Bynum is the greatest player to ever be part of the Philadelphia 76ers, and you think that I have absolutely zero chance of becoming best friends with Kelly Link.
Let’s end it here. Drop us a link to where we can buy I Made a Mistake. Also, if you’ve got a link to one or two of the collages from the book, throw them in as well.
KS: Thank you, Leigh. Wishing you and the Miami Dolphins a good year.
https://www.clashbooks.com/new-products-2/kevin-sampsell-i-made-an-accident-preorder
An interview with some pics and a video: https://www.orartswatch.org/kevin-sampsells-happy-accidents/
The Tumblr page I still somehow maintain: https://www.tumblr.com/kevinsampsellcollages
